Camel try Expert Leeching

[Chad]

i think he means he played for 3 days to make the recording (obviously failing a lot of times)

[***PL***]

Boys, Boys, Boys --

How about a little better MARP Forum etiquette? In particular, LN2, Novice and Francois.

If you want to continue to trade insults, do it offline

Also, everyone cool it with the foul language, OK?

[LN2]

PL, I don't get that at all. Francois and I have had great discussions in this thread. No insults at all thrown.

As far as Novice/Hisa...well you can clearly see the issue there I hope. I did apologize to MARP in a couple of my posts for resorting to calling him something in a couple of my posts(casled him an "asshole"...BTW that's the only "swear" word of any kind I have used in all of my recent posts)...but that was after he had called me far worse numerous times and I had nicely asked him to stop yet he wouldn't.

There must be a line where someone else can't just smear you as much as they want where you have to defend yourself...which was all I was doing.

He was allowed to do this several times with no moderator warning him at all so things got out of hand.

I only did that in 2 posts I think. The rest of my posts have nothing personal and am just discussing with respect to MARP and games.

I really like MARP and respect almost all members here. I think though if MARP continues to allow Novice to bully others around and treat them like crap and just do stuff to stir up trouble then it's not a place I will continue to participate. It's taking all the fun out of it.

Other than confirming and voting in these numerous polls that are all the result of Novice I likely will lay low on these forums for a while. It's not worth the time and effort contributing to numerous threads in a helpful manner for MARP to just end up getting attacked.

[QRS]

I agree fully with Rick here, period.

It is a big difference calling someone a ****** etc to have a heated discussion.

[Francois Daniel]

Defcon=7

Question.

5 This game may have some small(very very small) bug.
sometimes ball may warp to somewhere of screen.
If it happened, re-play is legal.
Is it right/not??

Francois

[BBH]

Defcon=7

Question.

5 This game may have some small(very very small) bug.
sometimes ball may warp to somewhere of screen.
If it happened, re-play is legal.
Is it right/not??

Francois

OOPS!!

Looks like Hisa just ended up owning himself. So much for feigning ignorance over the definition of "WARP", eh?

[LN2]

yet he and his JP friends are all voting here to turn MARP into just another Gamest....it's a shame. Don't you find it odd 90% have voted for the alphamame use rule for new high score preferences to avoid cheating yet then turn around and nearly half want to play the game differently which in this case is clearly cheating at Cameltry?

It will spoil the competition and fun for many games.
Outrun and Cameltry are just the start guys. Novice can do this for 100 other games.

100 more pointless discussions..100 more polls...that all end up not changing anything except spoiling and making high scores almost pointless for many games.

Why did this happen now versus 2-3 years ago? I would think that 2-3 years of MARP history had set the precedent for how games are played here....obviously not when 35% can come in vote to allow a cheat and it's accepted. It's odd all the previous players that played Cameltry and submitted scores here didn't use the trick. Sure maybe none knew the trick...but I'm guessing even if they knew the trick their gaming sense and gaming ethics would have told them that's not the way to play it so they don't use the trick.

MARP has opened a can of worms that is gonna get a lot worse in the near future guys. The editors really need to discuss this and have some vision for what MARP will be and should be. It's that 66% requirement that's screwing things up.

Think about it like this guys. You have 2 teams that want to play baseball. 1 team decides to play by different rules that are not part of how baseball is played. The 1 team most vote(not all on their team even) to allow the "trick". The other team all votes to not play using that "trick". With MARP's policies that trick is allowed. In real life the other team likely says screw that we came to play baseball not some new invented game that roughly resembles baseball....and goes home.

When I play Cameltry I want to play Cameltry. Playing it using this warp crap isn't Cameltry. It's some other different game.

These tricks are destroying the fun and competition. I'm sorry but it's not fun having to play a game dishonestly to compete. There isn't a more clear cut case than Cameltry so given this is allowed it means just about any of the 100+ other tricks for games will be allowed also.

[Francois Daniel]

Defcon=7

Question.

5 This game may have some small(very very small) bug.
sometimes ball may warp to somewhere of screen.
If it happened, re-play is legal.
Is it right/not??

Francois

OOPS!!

Looks like Hisa just ended up owning himself. So much for feigning ignorance over the definition of "WARP", eh?

It's beautiful, isn't it ?

[Francois Daniel]

Think about it like this guys. You have 2 teams that want to play baseball. 1 team decides to play by different rules that are not part of how baseball is played. The 1 team most vote(not all on their team even) to allow the "trick". The other team all votes to not play using that "trick". With MARP's policies that trick is allowed. In real life the other team likely says screw that we came to play baseball not some new invented game that roughly resembles baseball....and goes home.
.

I've an exemple who'd existed in real life. I play Tennis Table in championship. In the 90 years, a company create à racket with specials things in the materials of the racket. With it, the ball makes oddy facts in the play (sometimes it make no bounce, sometimes it makes zigzag in the air, etc). And in France a guy with very little skills reach the final tournament of French Championship with thsi racket. I guess, same event takes place in others countries. So, the ITTF (Internatinal Tennis Table Federation) make the decision to forbid this racket. It's the same things as the tricks the other guy know.

Francois

[diabolik]

yet he and his JP friends are all voting here to turn MARP into just another Gamest....it's a shame. Don't you find it odd 90% have voted for the alphamame use rule for new high score preferences to avoid cheating yet then turn around and nearly half want to play the game differently which in this case is clearly cheating at Cameltry?

Why are you continuously assuming that everybody voting for the trick to be allowed must be Hisa's japanese friends, or the poll must be somehow rigged? I'm sure editors can see who have voted in the polls (to prevent cheating) and I would be really surprised if more than 2 out of those 7 "yes" voters were japanese. And so what if they all are JP players? AFAIK, all MARPers have equal opportunity to vote, no matter what country they come from or if they have submitted 1 or 100 inps. Are you saying japanese players shouldn't be allowed to vote? If general public wants MARP to be like Gamest, so be it.

[LN2]

If general public wants MARP to be like Gamest, so be it.

Yes, this is certainly true I guess. However, why then is the push for use of alphamame to prevent lots of cheating getting is passing easily at 80-90%?

That makes a much different statement of what the MARP public wants. They want the scores here to mean something.

As stated in another thread there are 182 members for these forums.

Out of that 182, typically only 20-30 vote for any given poll. These are most likely the 20-30 that actively participate in the forums on a regular basis. Most of the MARP public doesn't. Given so few vote, and the vote is a 66% requirement to ban something, that means if 30 vote you only need 11 votes for a trick to be allowed.

Since such a small number is needed to approve it is very easy for someone to just contact a few friends that aren't actually active here at MARP and just have them also cast a vote in favor of support for their friend. Even if you only got 2-3 others to do that that significantly affects the outcome of the vote. It's also fairly easy to make 1-2 new accounts at MARP using other alias e-mail address to increase your voting power also. I think that's why Francois proposes to require a certain number of submitted scores at MARP and I add even perhaps a certain number of forum posts and/or perhaps a certain length of time between joining and voting. Maybe we need a poll on that. hehe although that's something I think the editors of MARP need to discuss and decide.

ie. if you saw 3 new accounts created on the same day and all 3 voted the same way for a poll...then weren't active otherwise...that would be very suspicious. I hope this isn't happening. I think the forum moderators need to check for this though...if possible to see who voted and how they voted in each poll. It's just doing a simple audit of the poll vote. This happens in elections all the time and is routine for many to make sure the voting process is working as it should.

I think it's all those factors together where many are saying the 66% requirement is just too much. It's too easy for even a minor level of collusion to influence the results.

Also again, why is it the active forum members are so strongly for alphamame then? That sends a different message. Ok, perhaps many in favor of alphamame haven't voted on this poll yet. I hope they do vote though.

So get out and please VOTE!

[Skyline]

Also again, why is it the active forum members are so strongly for alphamame then? That sends a different message. Ok, perhaps many in favor of alphamame haven't voted on this poll yet. I hope they do vote though.

People at MARP are obviously against using autofire, mapping more than one function to one button, using cheat.dat, intentionally using slowdown, hacking .inps, pausing/altering game settings during play, etc. AlphaMAME provides somewhat of a safeguard towards these things. The issue with certain bugs or leeching in a game is somewhat of a split. The exploitatin of flaws within a game's code is in a different category than using autofire and other dubious strategies which AlphaMAME prevents. Not a lot of people see the big deal in a little scoring bug. [Capcom certainly dosen't, I mean look at their wonky scoring methods. ] The word "cheating" in a video game is somewhat of a grey area since there are millions of ways that one could "cheat" or cut corners. (Hell, I met a guy once who said that anyone who constantly mashes on the fire button in vertical shooters has no skill at them. ) Exploiting a game's flaw is pretty much legal at MARP until someone uses it. Which is 50/50 since the spirit of MARP is to see who's the best at games played fair and square (ain't it? ) However in the case of blatant cheating and hacking .inps, there is no grey area.
AlphaMAME Sez: j00 no cheet wiff me. I kick yer ash if j00 try.