Outrun - Offroad or not.

The TJT · Post by **The TJT** » Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:00 am

I have very good chance beating your scores dear Hisa, it's only if I wánt to play enough. But I don't want to play the game 100's of times, definitely not 5000-10000 times, because that is not healthy, I'm mixed -but not that much

Maybe you think you have some kind of extraordinary skills that other players do not have, think again. Practice makes perfect.

piot · Post by **piot** » Thu Feb 20, 2003 9:35 am

Novice wrote: In my opinion, Ban poll which from "can not prove its unfair by one's skill" should be ignored.(current score is 16-0) but I accept and obey the rule of democraty.

How can you be sure that anyone voting against the trick haven't tried the trick ?

It seems you move the debate to the fact that noone tries the trick. The issue is "do we allow the trick or not ?".
My opinion is that no tricks or bugs should be use in any games whatever the skill needed to use it is. I'm sure it's hard to start the trick and I can only congrat you for succeeding but I don't care about it, I only want tricks and bugs uses to be banned from MARP.

QRS · Post by **QRS** » Thu Feb 20, 2003 10:21 am

I don´t care if I win or lose Hisa..*sigh* I just said that further discussions about this should wait until AFTER this poll is finished.

Do you really think that 43 mil is my alltime best on this game? I have played this game prolly just as much as you, but I don´t brag about how many hours, how many tricks I can etc.. Don´t worry. You will get to understand it one way or another later on

Good luck.

LN2 · Post by **LN2** » Thu Feb 20, 2003 5:12 pm

The TJT wrote:I have very good chance beating your scores dear Hisa, it's only if I wánt to play enough. But I don't want to play the game 100's of times, definitely not 5000-10000 times, because that is not healthy, I'm mixed -but not that much

Nah, with that trick it wouldn't take as much as you think. Just watch Hisa's 53 million inp run and you will see what I mean.

It would just require enough practice to learn how to do the trick well...then memorizing the course you take so you know how to setup for turns etc. or when to go offroad using the trick.

It's obvious Hisa takes the route where there is a field to one side or the other....doesn't take that mountain one or the pillar tunnel one where the offroad trick couldn't really be used during a big part of the course cuz mountains or pillars are on both sides. It means he couldn't stay at 293 most likely...not able to score as high going those routes to "B".

It would almost be interesting to have separate records for Outrun for each final goal....A-E...but that would allow too much weight for 1 game IMHO. However, I'm sure the top scores going to "D" as Hisa did are higher than going to "B". I'm not sure about the others....haven't raced all those different sections to test the difficulty to each final goal letter. Obviously some routes that offroad trick won't be able to be used nearly as much as for others.

Chad · Post by **Chad** » Thu Feb 20, 2003 11:36 pm

Hisa, your "no trick" outrun recording is corrupt, the zip file has a CRC problem, please upload again :(

http://marp.retrogames.com/inp/7nt_outr ... _m37b2.zip

http://marp.retrogames.com/index.cgi?mo ... 00&tourn=0

LN2 · Post by **LN2** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 4:22 am

plus why playing that with such an older version of mame? 37b2? man that's old....givne Outrun plays just fine in more current versions really little to no reason to use a very old version like that.

For Sega driving games like Hang-on that's different...but you would be using version 36 then.

Chad · Post by **Chad** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 2:39 pm

come on give him a break :P, there was life before mame60. all versions are allowed here, AHEM, even mac versions ( which 99% of us can't playback :)

INNUENDO · Post by **INNUENDO** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 6:00 pm

Hey, LN2. You can see some of my scores... I used 36b8 in the most of my games. Because in that time I had a bad computer (slower) and this emulator was nice to run many games... I like this emulator and 37b5 too...

LN2 · Post by **LN2** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 6:27 pm

Chad wrote:come on give him a break , there was life before mame60. all versions are allowed here, AHEM, even mac versions ( which 99% of us can't playback

k, I'll give him a break...but found it odd the Outrun inp using the trick was done with version 0.57(I think) yet now this newer inp recording was done with 0.37b2.

I didn't get on him for using 0.57...but don't you find it strange he was using 0.57 for playing Outrun and now has gone back to 0.37b2? It makes a little voice in me say "why did he use 0.37b2 this time?"

I would have just expected him to keep using 0.57.

That's all I meant by my comment...nothing more.

Chad · Post by **Chad** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 6:30 pm

oh ok :) i suspect he didn't record it new, i.e. had an old recording recorded around when m37b2 was the latest and greatest but his words did imply it was a recent recording.

QRS · Post by **QRS** » Fri Feb 21, 2003 7:11 pm

Don´t you all know that Hisa always uses different kinds of mames to almost every upload?

I have no idea why, but I guess it has to do with some versions are better to use for the emulation of the game etc.
I´d like to point out (If Hisa reads this) that I have the deepest respect for his gameplay and also his honesty when it comes to games. You have my deepest respect for that Hisa!
I just thought I might say that too, after all negative talk from me before

Of course I stand for those things I said earlier in this thread etc, but when it comes to games/gameplay he is one of the best players I have ever seen period.

About Outrun and the sega games.. I had no idea that Outrun really worked until I tried it in mame 062 or something (I don´t remember) I played super hangon a few times on the betas after 36 final and it never worked any good.. therefore I thought it was the same with Outrun too.

For Super hangon you need 36 final ( I think) if you don´t wanna play with a sometimes invissible bike

LordGaz · Post by **LordGaz** » Sat Feb 22, 2003 8:33 am

LN2 wrote:k, I'll give him a break...but found it odd the Outrun inp using the trick was done with version 0.57(I think) yet now this newer inp recording was done with 0.37b2.

I didn't get on him for using 0.57...but don't you find it strange he was using 0.57 for playing Outrun and now has gone back to 0.37b2? It makes a little voice in me say "why did he use 0.37b2 this time?"

I would have just expected him to keep using 0.57.

That's all I meant by my comment...nothing more.

I don't know what the suggestion is in this case but I believe it wouldn't be too much of a problem for a programmer to hack the MAME source where the inp data is generated and recompile a version where slowdown is undetectable in the inp (plus any other cheats they wanted to add). Ie to give the illusion that the recording was made at 100% speed throughout. I don't know anyone on MARP who would do that though. This is a case for enforcing Alphamame.

Gaz

DRN · Post by **DRN** » Sat Feb 22, 2003 10:30 am

I don't know what the suggestion is in this case but I believe it wouldn't be too much of a problem for a programmer to hack the MAME source where the inp data is generated and recompile a version where slowdown is undetectable in the inp (plus any other cheats they wanted to add). Ie to give the illusion that the recording was made at 100% speed throughout.

If anyone went to such lengths to submit top scores then that's just sad! I really don't think anyone on marp has ever done that but if they have then they must lead pretty miserable lives if they are that desperate for recognition.
I sometimes find using older versions of mame very helpful for recording. For alot of Atari system 2 games I get much better results using an old 36 beta. You record using 0.65 then its going to fail, simple as that. And there is also a speed issue as well. With every new release of mame the games seem to run slower and slower (for me anyway). Paperboy runs at about 25-30fps in 0.65, in 0.36b4 it's 60fps. This applies to many other games too. Of course it doesnt help if you have a crappy pc like mine

Chad · Post by **Chad** » Sat Feb 22, 2003 1:25 pm

I added a note to the special rules of these clones about this vote. Please look it over, and if anyone has a better description how to do the trick lemme know.

http://marp.retrogames.com/index.cgi?mo ... rt&tourn=0

Novice · Post by **Novice** » Sat Feb 22, 2003 3:04 pm

Defcon= 6

Chad wrote:Hisa, your "no trick" outrun recording is corrupt, the zip file has a CRC problem, please upload again

http://marp.retrogames.com/inp/7nt_outr ... _m37b2.zip

http://marp.retrogames.com/index.cgi?mo ... 00&tourn=0

At most of mame,outruna and outrunb do not work well.
missing road,cannot run etc.etc..
37b2 is the newest version of mame which run outruna and outrunb well among all I own.
mame65 was not good,too.

I found TGmame64 is good for this.

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Outrun - Offroad or not.

Should the "Offroad" trick be allowed?

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