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Phil Lamat wrote:And what is your definition of "as quickly as possible" ?
30s ? 3 mn ? 10 mn ?
all is quick comparing to infinite time you can get after special attack.

I mean exactly what I said. After using the special, you must then try to clear the stage. No leeching, no delay tactics, just try to clear the stage.

stages minus specials seems a decent scoring method. Enforcing no leeching would also be good but it does get difficult to determine quick or not quick enough to clear a stage, since you can accidentally miss the pinstack to clear the board and not be quick and also not be intending to leech. Leeching infinitively with this game is possible with any character on the levels where the pins are not pushed down so there is no time limit... if the pins pushed down on all levels (like puzzle bobble) the scoring as it stands would be fine. clearly the scoring needs to be changed on this game.

How about just stating that players must make every effort to finish the stage as quickly as possible after using a special? Would be much simpler than trying to change a scoring system that isn't the problem.

I'm afraid this wouldn't solve the probleme, cause (when using one of the 3 mentionned character) even if you don't leech the level, the scrolling is stopped, so that you CAN NOT LOOSE the level. So it won't be fair for the players using the other nine characters, cause for them the pins keep going down.

3 questions to Ghemant or Hisa :
1- what is the Gamest hiscore for this game ?
2- do you ever heard about the bug we are talking about in Arcade version ?
3- apparently there is a hidden character (Sara) : do you know the code to get her ?

Leeching infinitively with this game is possible with any character on the levels where the pins are not pushed down so there is no time limit...

In fact it doesn't depend on the levels, it only depends on the characters. When launching the special attack with any of the three mentioned characters, the scrolling stops, in any level.

Which means we can have normal gameplay, difficulty, scoring, etc... only by baning those characters. The rule would be easy to understand and to check while replaying, and there would be no possible leeching, therefore no complaining gamers.

That would be cool, but i'm not so sure there aren't levels that do not scroll just because you used a special. Phil do you agree with this? I thought i remember levels not scrolling even when i didn't use a special.

GNU is perfectly right as far as I know : I've tested all the characters on stage 1 using -cheat and enabling "special meter always max" ; scroll down only stops after Syanon-Dyena-Amless attack.
For other characters scroll down doesn't stop after special attack
(you can test by yourself : less than 1 mn per character)

Phil Lamat wrote:(you can test by yourself : less than 1 mn per character)

I think you need to test higher levels than just 1mn on level 1. It could be i just always did a special to start a certain level maybe 6,7 or 9 and that's why it froze. But that might be great we just limit to certain characters and then leeching can be nipped, i will test when i get home.

***EDIT
yeah, it does seem like with other players (in level 8), i used the Lion character, it doesn't freeze the scrolling. cool.

Hi there,

anything new about this case ? Do we need more people to give their opinion ? (i don't know the process here on MARP)

I hadn't seen that Chad has edited his last post after some testing.
My proposal :
1- archive all inputs made with a buggy character (making an entry such as *pzlbowl-bug)
2- ban the 3 buggy characters for Marp regulation
and
3- let's play in a non-bugged way

Ok, I've edited all pzlbowl entries to show what character has been used.
All is ready to ban the 3 buggy characters and move all inputs using these ones to an archive entry (*pzlbowl_bug).
The question is : do we need a vote first ?
or can Pat proceed now ?

Matt, you are still regulation coordinator.
So ?

This is a no brainer ban special characters, but it's for bbh to decide. The only argument against i can think of is that the characters left after the ban have too weak special moves, but the banned characters have too strong special moves, so it cancels itself out.

Sorry for the delay on this one. I've been slacking off on my duties it seems I'll try to get to other outstanding issues very soon.

The only way I can see the special characters being allowable would be if you were required to finish the level in a timely manner after using that special move, but it's pretty hard to set a time limit that's acceptable for all levels. Would it then turn into leeching as much as possible within the time limit and still clearing the level? Not to mention the headache it would be for editors to confirm...

I admit I'm not that familiar with this game at all, but if the game is perfectly playable with the characters that don't cause the screen to freeze, then yes we should ban the special characters. If anyone has a compelling reason to allow the special characters, speak up now.

Phil Lamat wrote:I hadn't seen that Chad has edited his last post after some testing.
My proposal :
1- archive all inputs made with a buggy character (making an entry such as *pzlbowl-bug)
2- ban the 3 buggy characters for Marp regulation
and
3- let's play in a non-bugged way

OK, this is the right way to proceed...

*pzlbowl-bug "Puzzle De Bowling (Japan) [bug]"

has been added

Thanks Pat.
I've moved all inputs made with Amless, Dyena or Syanon to *pzlbowl-bug.
Now everything is ok.

And I've started to play with non-bugged character, believe me it isn't the same story when scroll down doesn't stop
Finish some levels is hard even with use of a special attack, where the simple use of a special attack with a bugged character was simply meaning "level clear" (no scroll down = no death). Plus now you can't leech and refill your power bar easily, which means you have to use your special attacks very smartly.

For sure the game has been thought to play this way, and it's much more entertaining trying to finish it like that.