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mahlemiut wrote:I go by the rule "If it puts me to sleep, then it's probably leeching"

Ok, rules page updated:

h) Point or life leeching is strongly discouraged, and banned on some games, as described in the banned techniques list, or in the specific game's special rules. You cannot continuously gain points without some degree of risk and you must keep moving to keep Barry awake.

Just kidding

Maybe we should have a poll.

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"If you build it, he will come"

Shoeless Joe Jackson: Is this heaven?
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destructor wrote:

Chad wrote:

Zhorik wrote:Sure, it takes a lot (if not most) of the fun out of competing on the game, but that is true for a lot of games.

gag me. that's the point of putting rules like this in place to make the games fun for everyone not just for the people who want to leech... this clearly is a repetative leeching maneuver "safety spot" (the kind by which the rules are meant for), yes technically (by the lamest of terms) you are continuing the inning and playing the game but your not doing anything else, how the heck is that different than any other form of leeching. name me one game where the leeching is banned and it's a worse breaking of the rule than this technique.

In Champion Baseball it's not leeching, it's method, I don't see any other method for this game, it's impossible to get good score or interesting replay without this method. Try to play on it.

I don't agree with you here Des. The third place recording completes all 9 innings without using this trick, surely that recording is worth watching, and as Barry said, its hard to stay awake watching the two top recordings to the end

I would agree on splitting it, one for those who likes to play it your way, and one for those who don't, but I fear that will not fit the Splitting rules of MARP

I agree with Chad. This belongs on the Tricks page.

mahlemiut wrote:I go by the rule "If it puts me to sleep, then it's probably leeching"

I watched one inp, and that was more than enough for me.

I sometimes go to sleep even after watch Esprade inp
Try to not sleep during watch galaxian inp, no leeching in this game

Frankie wrote:I don't agree with you here Des. The third place recording completes all 9 innings without using this trick, surely that recording is worth watching, and as Barry said, its hard to stay awake watching the two top recordings to the end

Do you want 9 innings game? OK, maybe I didn't delete it from my HD. What is interesting that he finish 9 innings? Nothing, I can make it every time. It is more than simple. Try to use 'safe method' and play 2 hours. Be aware for you health.

destructor wrote:

Frankie wrote:I don't agree with you here Des. The third place recording completes all 9 innings without using this trick, surely that recording is worth watching, and as Barry said, its hard to stay awake watching the two top recordings to the end

Do you want 9 innings game? OK, maybe I didn't delete it from my HD. What is interesting that he finish 9 innings? Nothing, I can make it every time. It is more than simple. Try to use 'safe method' and play 2 hours. Be aware for you health.

Exactly, why force people to risk their good health, not to speak of those who have to confirm the recordings

Yes, it's boring to watch but interesting. I think every man on MARP was interesting how works 'safe method' and now some of them want to ban them
For confirmers, please enable frameskip 11 and press F10

destructor wrote:Yes, it's boring to watch but interesting. I think every man on MARP was interesting how works 'safe method' and now some of them want to ban them
For confirmers, please enable frameskip 11 and press F10

That's allright Des, but we should still have the possibility to move it to the tricks page, where players can also see it. Then we can link to it in the Special Rules, so that players can easily find and watch it.

As Chad have already said it should be top priority to make a game as fun as possible. I can't believe players think its funny to play it like that. I don't even think you think its funny when I understand you right

Don't do it. I want to see on MARP better scores than TG. And how many players will play on this game? 2, 3? I think for this game isn't required special rules and ban this method. Believe me it's not easy to do very high score, it's interesting to see how players made extra high scores with this method.

i'd certainly rather see 2 or 3 players competing for legitimate runs scored than a grip of people marathoning one trick for a game that has many other difficulties to over come or des boasting of his leeching prowes in yet another game. Or actually i'd rather see des complete a "destructor" easy 9 inning game :) tg is another place than marp.

Barry, there are tons of boring replays that have no leeching aspect.

watching someone run a 9th key pattern over and over 235 times in a row for a 4 hour period is boring.

Face it guys, if this was a Playchoice-10 game with the timelimit, you really wouldn't care about this type of redundancy in the gameplay.

Finishing and winning a 9 inning game legitimately is not that difficult.

Oh, wtf happens if I happen to get into that situation and have a few swip-hits and use my runners in a similar manner to make sure they are safe a few times to get a few more runs?

...then play out the game as you call "normally". Would you shun it for using that skill?

I agree, it makes it potentially marathonable and boring to watch the replay of someone doing the same thing over and over.

However, the only other replay from this particular game that would have any interest at all for me would be one where the opponent is held to a very low run total.

A replay that is 25-12 versus 32-18 means little to nothing for me.

A 15-2 as mentione above would get my interests.

So for the high scores....bunt away!

It's not a type of leech that any lame gamer can do. It does take a little timing and skill to execute over and over and over again.

I remember even when I was good at it I think I only had 1 inning where I had scored 99+ runs in an inning. Most of the time I would average more around 20-30 runs before messing up.

Then it takes some skill to get a couple hits in the later innings to set up the scenario gaain. Most have difficulty getting more than 1 hit in an inning after the 4th or 5th innings...although that depends on how your opponent is scoring.

Face it, the first 2 innings, anyone can score some runs from hits. In later innings most won't be scoring runs or very few...not like the first few innings for sure.

My point there is the game dynamic changes. same timing for swinging etc. has a different result in a later inning. Fair? nah. the game was built that way.

LN2 wrote:Barry, there are tons of boring replays that have no leeching aspect.

but none of these use the same method over and overagain with NO end.

LN2 wrote:watching someone run a 9th key pattern over and over 235 times in a row for a 4 hour period is boring.

pacman stops at a kill screen.

LN2 wrote:Face it guys, if this was a Playchoice-10 game with the timelimit, you really wouldn't care about this type of redundancy in the gameplay.

time limit is not the issue here it's leeching the same thing over and over.

LN2 wrote:Finishing and winning a 9 inning game legitimately is not that difficult.

It's harder than getting the timing right for bunting forever.

LN2 wrote:Oh, wtf happens if I happen to get into that situation and have a few swip-hits and use my runners in a similar manner to make sure they are safe a few times to get a few more runs? ...then play out the game as you call "normally". Would you shun it for using that skill?

the rule will state no runners can steal home, if you squiB a hit that's ok, you can sacrifice a run in as well, but you just can't run home after the you've stalled the catcher to miss the out at first.

LN2 wrote:I agree, it makes it potentially marathonable and boring to watch the replay of someone doing the same thing over and over.

However, the only other replay from this particular game that would have any interest at all for me would be one where the opponent is held to a very low run total.

A replay that is 25-12 versus 32-18 means little to nothing for me.

A 15-2 as mentione above would get my interests.

and how many replays like that would you see if we allowed the bunting rule?

LN2 wrote:It's not a type of leech that any lame gamer can do. It does take a little timing and skill to execute over and over and over again.
I remember even when I was good at it I think I only had 1 inning where I had scored 99+ runs in an inning. Most of the time I would average more around 20-30 runs before messing up.

Then it takes some skill to get a couple hits in the later innings to set up the scenario gaain. Most have difficulty getting more than 1 hit in an inning after the 4th or 5th innings...although that depends on how your opponent is scoring.

Yes, and you do have to set it up properly with some luck but once you get the timing right you're good as getting to infinity. There's no point in calling this too difficult not to be leeching.

LN2 wrote:Face it, the first 2 innings, anyone can score some runs from hits. In later innings most won't be scoring runs or very few...not like the first few innings for sure.

My point there is the game dynamic changes. same timing for swinging etc. has a different result in a later inning. Fair? nah. the game was built that way.

There are no dynamic changes in the early innings the same repetative sequence of pitches are thrown, there's a ramp up in difficulty in later innings yes but you can get an infinitive # of runs in the early innings with the right timing that is the problem.

LN2 wrote:Barry, there are tons of boring replays that have no leeching aspect.

That's why I used the word "probably".

I do agree with you that Pacman is boring.

Chad wrote:the rule will state no runners can steal home, if you squiB a hit that's ok, you can sacrifice a run in as well, but you just can't run home after the you've stalled the catcher to miss the out at first.

cmon, if I get a swib hit I am going to try and draw the throw to home plate otherwise my guy is out at first base....or runner going to second.

So you are saying in that situation we are to do nothing and accept the out? cmon.

and how many replays like that would you see if we allowed the bunting rule?

just as likely to see it either way if the gamer puts won 15-2 in the description. I would download and watch that even if it was good for 9th place.

There are no dynamic changes in the early innings the same repetative sequence of pitches are thrown, there's a ramp up in difficulty in later innings yes but you can get an infinitive # of runs in the early innings with the right timing that is the problem.

ok, so someone with such great timing to get hit after hit after hit with every 3rd being a home run etc. is just leeching as well if they do it over and over?

it is dynamic though because the width of the timing window to get solid contact and evne get home runs is much wider in the first 2 innings than later in the game. Even the opponent fielders change. They move slow early...but then on a flyball seem to warp to the spot waiting for the ball when the point of view changes. fair?

it's an ok simulation for the year it was out but overall is flawed and not really any better than early home console baseball games.

LN2 wrote:cmon, if I get a swib hit I am going to try and draw the throw to home plate otherwise my guy is out at first base....or runner going to second.
So you are saying in that situation we are to do nothing and accept the out? cmon.

huh, any basebal player would be extactic to get a run for an out, jeeze. Not to say that getting the run with out making an out is worse in baseball; but if that's ALL you do in the game that's what we're trying to avoid here.

LN2 wrote:

and how many replays like that would you see if we allowed the bunting rule?

just as likely to see it either way if the gamer puts won 15-2 in the description. I would download and watch that even if it was good for 9th place.

Granted the likely hood of 15-2 games coming up is proably still just as likely if we were all computers. But we are humans, If a game is allowed to where you must use a repeatative scoring technique to get first place it will loose interest in the peope for some who like getting a high marp placed score thus elimintating the chance for that human who might be capable of such a game to never play it and submit to marp again.

LN2 wrote:ok, so someone with such great timing to get hit after hit after hit with every 3rd being a home run etc. is just leeching as well if they do it over and over?

You can't tell me that getting great timing to make a hit is easier than bunting, someone would have done it by now! It's hellishly harder that's why we need the bunting to be disallowed.

LN2 wrote:it is dynamic though because the width of the timing window to get solid contact and evne get home runs is much wider in the first 2 innings than later in the game. Even the opponent fielders change. They move slow early...but then on a flyball seem to warp to the spot waiting for the ball when the point of view changes. fair?

Yes it's a ramp up in difficult as the game progresses, it's like any good game in the world :) To get around the difficult by leeching runs with an easy manuever is EXACTLY why we have a leeching rule at marp.

If we would ban the trick, what would special rules say?
I mean, we wouldn't want to vote the trick out and then notice you can't make clear-cut rule against it... if it was allowed once/twice per...uh, "inning" I guess? Not allowed at all? Do current completed games include the trick, would we have to zero all scores/2 scores etc.
Would the game scoring system be enough to differentiate "better" players who finish the game etc.