I bet they are loving all the attention they are getting and disruption this is causing. This is why they do it, they thrive on it. It's usually the case with people with small genitalia. Don't give them the attention they desparately crave.
I am sure that the majority of recordings here are fair. We have a good community with people that have been here many years. I trust the regular Marpers here and I'm sure that you all feel the same.
If anyone is that sad, that they have to go to the trouble of hacking Alphamame to submit a high score and their life is so lacking in attention and meaning, then they're not even worth getting pissed off about.
The End
Moderators: mahlemiut, seymour, QRS
Rather than flaming / complaining (my thought lean on the side of the MARPers, but not 100%... 0.1% otherwise LOL), I have put together some thoughts. No conclusions, just thoughts.
The encryption process needs to be done such that the decyption process is not available in the exe. In order to confirm that the inp is correct it has to be viewed. In order to view something the decrypted version of the inp must be available for viewing. So, if the encyption process uses a public/private key affair (RSA / Diffie Helman), then the decryption process can be done on uploading to MARP and the decrypted version is then available for download. The problem then faced is that of encrypting during play with minimal disturbance to the game play.
The problem still lies in that the encryption process still is in the MAME exe. This leaves the encryption process to be hacked out, a cheated inp to be converted & no resolution to the end result.
The encryption process needs to be done such that the decyption process is not available in the exe. In order to confirm that the inp is correct it has to be viewed. In order to view something the decrypted version of the inp must be available for viewing. So, if the encyption process uses a public/private key affair (RSA / Diffie Helman), then the decryption process can be done on uploading to MARP and the decrypted version is then available for download. The problem then faced is that of encrypting during play with minimal disturbance to the game play.
The problem still lies in that the encryption process still is in the MAME exe. This leaves the encryption process to be hacked out, a cheated inp to be converted & no resolution to the end result.
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Francois Daniel
- MARP Seer
- Posts: 625
- Joined: Tue May 28, 2002 8:11 am
Naaa,otherwise we would already have the most nasty protection devices already hacked up.He just saw that the AlphaMAME encryption was easy so he put his effort on that.If it was something more tedious he would have probably gived up and you'll never know of that...LN2 wrote:As stated it's not worth the trouble to try and make it secure from hackers. This guy can likely hack just about anything anyway. Don't fight his war.
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Mr. Kelly R. Flewin
- MARP Knight
- Posts: 317
- Joined: Thu Jul 18, 2002 4:59 am
- Location: Somewhere over the Rainbow
$10 says this guy contributed and got one [or more] scores blocked with Alphamame and had a major hissy fit [that would make Courtney Love look VERY well balanced] and poof!LN2 wrote:cmon...you read that chat log above...no way he would have stopped.
He has something out for Barry or the MARP community for whatever reason.
Kelly
Just a gaming junkie looking for his next High Score fix.
yeah i don't doubt that (or one of his illustrious followers complained to him that their scores were blocked.) And he *would* have stopped if the executable was more secure than it was. His claim that he can hack anything is bull. He proly can more likely hack anything that is "easy" to hack, which this alphamame was compared to other "secure" things. For one a good hacker knows that you can link scramble code to make it impossible for any dissasembler to easily find the encryption part of a secure mame, which is what was done here (Neal would have given up if IDA couldn't determine where the encryption was.) But beyond link scrambling you have to do something more for the hackers higher than nielly, and when we get to that point (kale if you know?) i'll make another secure mame.Mr. Kelly R. Flewin wrote:$10 says this guy contributed and got one [or more] scores blocked with Alphamame and had a major hissy fit [that would make Courtney Love look VERY well balanced] and poof!LN2 wrote:cmon...you read that chat log above...no way he would have stopped.
He has something out for Barry or the MARP community for whatever reason.
Kelly
-skito
mahlemiut wrote in Alphamame readme...
How does the encryption work?
-----------------------------
If I told you that, then I would have to kill you.
Who is first?
Mindrape
Aerolupus
Neil.
By the way I played the Guantlet emulator.
Pretty cool really (fast).
I do not advocate their behavior though.
children
How does the encryption work?
-----------------------------
If I told you that, then I would have to kill you.
Who is first?
Mindrape
Aerolupus
Neil.
By the way I played the Guantlet emulator.
Pretty cool really (fast).
I do not advocate their behavior though.
children-
Neillparatzo
- Button Slapper
- Posts: 3
- Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2003 8:22 pm
Well. What can I say? I replied to skito's post earlier because I thought he was the only person here, besides Barry, who knew what the hell was going on. I see I jumped the gun on that, but I'll get to that in a minute.
As for the rest of you? Look at you. Every last one of you is completely clueless. I don't accept that there's a dichotomy between any of you and the cheaters you love to put down; you're just as lame as they are.
And so you put all your faith in the AlphaMAME house of cards, just because some people with false authority said it was unbreakable. And what happens when that false authority is questioned? You're helpless to do anything but lash out with juvenile insults and hilarious conspiracy theories. It's simultaneously pathetic and entrancing to watch.
I've never contributed a score here, blocked or otherwise. I wouldn't want to. MARP is nothing more than a sad little clique. When I want "friendly competition", I look somewhere friendly, and when I want to post scores for the hell of it, I've got my own page for that already. I don't like your attitudes. Coincidentally, that's also why I did the INP hack. You only brought it on yourselves.
And now to skito - quoting buzzwords and regurgitating what you've heard other people say might make you sound intelligent, but it's not quite the same as understanding security. (This probably has something to do with why you marked AlphaMAME as unbreakable, though of course that's just a guess.) Link permutation is in fact an excellent way to watermark closed-source code, but it would have made no difference in AlphaMAME's case. Do you understand why? If not, you're just doomed to repeat the same mistakes, over and over.
And as for Barry, you're unfortunately going to have to take my word for it that I have nothing against you personally. You're only a casualty in all this.
As for the rest of you? Look at you. Every last one of you is completely clueless. I don't accept that there's a dichotomy between any of you and the cheaters you love to put down; you're just as lame as they are.
And so you put all your faith in the AlphaMAME house of cards, just because some people with false authority said it was unbreakable. And what happens when that false authority is questioned? You're helpless to do anything but lash out with juvenile insults and hilarious conspiracy theories. It's simultaneously pathetic and entrancing to watch.
I've never contributed a score here, blocked or otherwise. I wouldn't want to. MARP is nothing more than a sad little clique. When I want "friendly competition", I look somewhere friendly, and when I want to post scores for the hell of it, I've got my own page for that already. I don't like your attitudes. Coincidentally, that's also why I did the INP hack. You only brought it on yourselves.
And now to skito - quoting buzzwords and regurgitating what you've heard other people say might make you sound intelligent, but it's not quite the same as understanding security. (This probably has something to do with why you marked AlphaMAME as unbreakable, though of course that's just a guess.) Link permutation is in fact an excellent way to watermark closed-source code, but it would have made no difference in AlphaMAME's case. Do you understand why? If not, you're just doomed to repeat the same mistakes, over and over.
And as for Barry, you're unfortunately going to have to take my word for it that I have nothing against you personally. You're only a casualty in all this.
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Q.T.Quazar
- MARP Knight
- Posts: 377
- Joined: Sun Jun 08, 2003 10:14 am
Brilliant metaphor! Where did you go to school? I didn't even know there were special ed. programs for hackers. Hey, the turtle in LOGO isn't real, you know.And so you put all your faith in the AlphaMAME house of cards, just because some people with false authority said it was unbreakable.
Oh, and by the false authority vested in me, I dub thee Sir Remnes, heir to the Throne of Stig.
But even Stig had the grace to eventually disappear from where he wasn't wanted. We can only hope your odor won't linger quite as long.
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BrokenVaus--Q.T.Quazar's law of MAME: Any game I am good at will have something seriously f***ed with its emulation.
BrokenVaus--Q.T.Quazar's law of MAME: Any game I am good at will have something seriously f***ed with its emulation.
It is entrancing to see peons like Neill hack games to show that these games are not completely cheat proof. I think Johnny Cochran should invite Neill to be a partner in his law firm. They could come up with the "Neill defense:"
Your honor my client only broke into the apartment, stole $34,000, and killed the family to show that the family was so hypocritical for locking their doors at night. You see your honor, there is no such thing as 100% security as my client demonstrated. The family brought their deaths upon themselves for blindly placing their faith in simple locks that most burglars can break. My client was trying to make a point, and only make a point. The family was just a casualty in all this. Please take my client's word that he had nothing personal against the family. Clearly he is innocent of any wrong doing.
Your honor my client only broke into the apartment, stole $34,000, and killed the family to show that the family was so hypocritical for locking their doors at night. You see your honor, there is no such thing as 100% security as my client demonstrated. The family brought their deaths upon themselves for blindly placing their faith in simple locks that most burglars can break. My client was trying to make a point, and only make a point. The family was just a casualty in all this. Please take my client's word that he had nothing personal against the family. Clearly he is innocent of any wrong doing.
Last edited by zlk on Tue Jul 01, 2003 9:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
clique? we honor all scores, reguardless of background or better or worse as long as they playback, yeah we blocked regular mame scores but they were still kept on the site and a friendly reminder to record with alphamame next time.
buzzwords? unbreakable? all any us said was that it was secure to the average gamer that wants to cheat, that's all that was needed to improve (decrease) the suspicion level and analyzable detects of known cheating recordings. And go figure, it worked. We just wanted to reduce that! If you think that was wrong to do you're really not in this conversation at all.
I'm affraid you jumped the gun and missed the points at all angles and just set marp back a few months. No sweat, later we'll make a secure executable that you can't break, someone else will be able to but they'll actually realize it's a good thing to have a secure mame and tell us how we can stop them from breaking it, and make progress.
buzzwords? unbreakable? all any us said was that it was secure to the average gamer that wants to cheat, that's all that was needed to improve (decrease) the suspicion level and analyzable detects of known cheating recordings. And go figure, it worked. We just wanted to reduce that! If you think that was wrong to do you're really not in this conversation at all.
I'm affraid you jumped the gun and missed the points at all angles and just set marp back a few months. No sweat, later we'll make a secure executable that you can't break, someone else will be able to but they'll actually realize it's a good thing to have a secure mame and tell us how we can stop them from breaking it, and make progress.
-skito
RE
Ok Can we all stop this now? What Neil has done is sort of ehhr done already. No need for flaming posts, etc, etc etc... *sigh*
No one on earth will change his opinion on this, and he can´t change ours, so let this post die instead. Right now we are all playing Neils game.
Thanks.
No one on earth will change his opinion on this, and he can´t change ours, so let this post die instead. Right now we are all playing Neils game.
Thanks.
QRS